hello I’m Matt Galloway and this is the current podcast never heard so much Malarkey in my whole life every single thing he said Is A Lie every single one he has no idea what the hell he’s talking about this guy has no sense of American democracy they spent money like a bunch of people that didn’t know what they were doing and they don’t know what they were doing it was the worst probably the worst Administration in history he’s the worst president in the history of our country he’s destroyed our country it didn’t even start with a handshake CNN hosted the first debate in this presidental campaign featuring presumed nominees Donald Trump and Joe Biden and as you heard the mood was not friendly there were personal barbs but at the end of 90 minutes what’s making the headlines are Joe Biden’s repeated stumbles and Donald Trump’s repeated falsehoods John fund is a columnist for the National Review and a senior fellow at the committee to unleash Prosperity Craig varoga is a democratic strategist he’s based in Washington DC good morning to you both good morning pleasure Craig um we’ll get to the specifics in just a moment but how bad was this debate for the Democrats look I you know I mean vice president Harris last night said the president got off to a a slow start uh you know there were rough moments uh it’s also apparent that he had a cold but I don’t want to spin anything you know it was It was kind of sluggish it was a it was a brawl but at the end of the day I mean Donald Trump you know wouldn’t condemn the people who rioted and tried to overturn the election he wouldn’t reject and he still bragged about overturning Row versus Wade and uh he had no at all about you know being a a felon uh you know instead he talked about porn stars and he talked about Golf and he you know you know made at least 30 lies you know over the course of the debate so I I think that you know as time goes on you know it’s like President Trump’s complete you know un qualification for the office you know it’s like if you look at it if you if you look at it as a media consultant you know Donald Trump said a lot of things that you can put in TV ads you know that are not good for him we’ll come back to that in a moment John fund broadly your uh first blush impressions of this debate well first of all no it was not a good debate for Donald Trump he was the same as he usually is blustering and all of that but for once I think your readers deserve something better than the White House spin machine the president if he had a cold was working the Rope lines shaking hands with dozens and dozens of people in Atlanta as he landed last night if you have a cold in the age of covid you don’t do that if the president had a told he was being completely irresponsible in shaking hundreds of hands so let’s start with let’s no more have no more White House spin machine I’m not here to spin for Donald Trump let’s not have have ridiculous spin machines for the White House the reason that people are asking questions about Joe Biden and there are questions being asked which we can get to about his future in this campaign are because of moments like this have a listen to Joe Biden last night I what I’m going to do is fix the tax system for example we have a thousand trillionaires in America I mean billionaires in America and what’s happening they’re in a situation where they in fact pay 88.2% in taxes if they just paid 24% 25% either one of those numbers they’d raise $500 million billion dollars I should say in a 10-year period we’d be able to write wipe out his debt we’d be able to help make sure that all those things we need to do Child Care Elder Care making sure that we continue to strens our health care System making sure that we’re able to make every single solitary person eligible for what I’ve been able to do with the uh with with with the co excuse me with um dealing with everything we have to do with uh look if we finally beat Medicare Craig when that happened what was going through your mind uh what was going through my mind is that you know I hope that he would answer the question again what was the bar that you think was set for Joe Biden in in in this debate and did he meet that bar you know look I mean even the vice president said he got off to a sluggish start you know his campaign co-chair said he got off to a sluggish start I I think that when he spoke from the heart you know he did better uh than when he was you know trying to I mean reiterate like a bunch of talking points you know and if if you look at it tactically you know rather than you know the contrast between two candidates he was trying and many many cases you know he was trying to fact check Donald Trump in real time which I think you know is you know impossible to do for a lot of people the test was also whether I mean there had been questions around his age and those questions had been dismissed by democrats been dismissed by people close to him and they said just watch him watch what he does on stage to a lot of people this was the test do you think he he passed that that test I think that they’re going to have to continue answering that question and I think the next week is going to be you know I mean very critical for them and I think that you know the vice president began to answer that last night but the president’s going to have to answer it as well John fund what do you think the the bar was for for Joe Biden in this debate well first of all let me agree with Craig I don’t think the president’s performance was as bad as the media critics who are suddenly discovering we are shocked shocked shocked that Joe Biden is older saying uh however just remember he spent a week on debate prep at Camp David surrounded by skilled media advisers uh who knows you know what you know vitamins or other supplements he was taking um he had all the Time in the World to come up with a better performance than this and what CNN and polling for the Daily Mail and Britain say is that 68% of Voters think that Donald Trump won the debate and more importantly 68% of independent voters so I think it is devastating because the American people who do not follow politics and on a daily basis were shocked and frankly this is a media failure in the United States because if the media had done its job it should have had an alarm Bell in the night in February in February the president went through a physical and Walter Reed Medical Center he passed the physical his personal position issued a very short statement of four paragraphs saying the president was fine physically but he noted he had not given him a cognitive test and in addition he refused to answer any questions for reporters which is generally when given presidential Health coverups in America ranging from John F Kennedy to Franklin Roosevelt on down the line is a warning that there’s a cover up the media completely failed the American people in not alerting them Joe Biden’s problems long before Joe Biden demonstrated those problems himself last night Craig do you do you want to respond to that before we get to Donald Trump’s performance I think it’s interesting that you know John said that um it wasn’t the complete disaster that you know maybe some people in the media you know are saying it is and it’s like I think that we the Biden campaign has a challenge they have to deal with it we’ll see you know how that goes I mean you know but I also think that you know we saw the same Donald Trump as ever you know as John also pointed out and it’s you know at least 30 lies you it’s hard to keep track of them maybe that doesn’t matter you know maybe you know telling the truth doesn’t matter in some context you know with with Donald Trump you know the interesting thing about this race and you know it’s and it’s it’s one of those things in which you know I mean people spend a lot of time trying to understand this thing on the one hand it’s very static that a felony conviction for Donald Trump doesn’t really change you know the polling by much you know if the post felony can you know bump in the polling for President Biden it was maybe one point you know one and a half points it really wasn’t very much you know we’ll see we’ll see how this plays out we’re not going to know for a couple of days you know you know what it actually means John Fon you said that Donald Trump did not have a good night let’s have a listen to uh to Donald Trump last night we had the safest Border in the history of our country all he had to do is leave it he decided to open up our border open up our country to people that are from prisons people that are from mental institutions insane asylum terrorists we have the largest number of terrorists coming into our country right now all terrorists all over the world not just in South America all over the world they come from the Middle East everywhere all over the world they’re pouring in look we had the safest Border in history now we have the worst Border in history there’s never been anything like it John what did Donald Trump have to do in this debate last night well it turned out that all he had to do was abide by the rules that Joe Biden applied to the debate whatever political consultant told Joe Biden well you know Trump interrupted you too much in the 2020 debate so we’ll cut off his microphone when you’re talking so he can’t interrupt whoever gave him that advice should be fired because it turned out that that restrained Donald Trump and his natural inclination to go out of control and and it just gave more Biden time to hang himself uh it was it’s just one of the most astonishing political blunders I’ve ever heard of in my entire life does the truth matter I mean commentators have pointed out uh and Craig has mentioned as well a long stream of falsehoods that came out of Donald Trump’s mouth does the truth matter excuse me wait a second they pointed out a long stream of falsehoods that came out of both of their mouths both of their mouths but people specifically are talking about what Donald Trump said here yeah because I understand that and Donald Trump lies without consequence I understand all that but Joe Biden makes stuff up too he just does it in shall we say a less obnoxious way does the truth matter I mean I think there are people who would argue that there’s you’re creating a false equivalency between Donald Trump said and what Joe Biden said but in in the the PS don’t agree with you they don’t agree with you so you may have that opinion but people believe that all politicians lie they do and Donald Trump lies more than most of course he does but the bottom line is if you the American people have reached the point where 73% do not want this race between Donald Trump and Joe Biden so I agree with you believe me Donald Trump is not my candidate but there has to be an explanation and reporters are supposed to look at reality why is it that 73% dislike both candidates so much they prefer somebody else we running I heard somebody uh in one of the pre- debate uh spins saying that uh I’m not comfortable with Biden’s age and I don’t feel comfortable with Trump’s mouth um coming out of this Craig what happens now I mean can Joe Biden stay in this race you said that that there are going to be uh conversations this week difficult conversations within the Democratic party we heard uh David Axel Rod uh former Obama advisor saying that there will be discussions about whether he should stay what happens I mean I’m not sure you know what’s what what’s going to happen I mean we’re in a u i mean again you know this race long time uh you know we have the same two candidates who ran four years ago uh but at the same time so in some ways it’s very familiar but in other ways it’s very different uh and you know and I mean can he should he uh you know I think certainly the president you know plans on staying his campaign you know what do you think though as a democratic strategist what do you think coming out of yesterday do you think he should stay um you know I I I think they have a lot of work to do in the next in the next week to reassure the American public and the Democratic party and what would that look like I mean how if he stays how do you reassure people and can they reassure people if he does stay um you know look I I think that I mean you know Joe Biden himself has always said that you know it’s like you know he’s I me no candidate ever runs against the almighty everybody runs against you know the alternative uh you know and I mean as John and many other people you know say Donald Trump lies you know I mean at an unprecedented scale and you know I think that you know I mean you know I think that you know just on a I mean regardless of you know you know what the ultimate you know question may be or you know what happens here it’s like the more they talk about Donald Trump the better and I think that you know one of I mean it’s like I mean as John just said you know it’s like it probably was a fairly serious tactical mistake to have Donald Trump’s mic turned off you know because that allowed him to appear far more temperate uh than he really is so it’s like I I think they need to talk about you know Trump as much as they can you know over the well not just the next week over the next you know you know 19 weeks or whatever you know whatever it might be guess I guess you just wonder I guess you just wonder whether they’ll be talking about Trump at all though whether the or whether the conversation will just be focused on Joe Biden you mean within the campaign yeah I mean whether whether that’s whether the conversation is not going to be about the opponent but it’s going to be about the nominee and who that nominee should actually be yeah I mean it’s look that is not a question that any campaign would want to deal with you know a month or a month and a half or two months before before their convention and you know clearly you know everybody’s going to be a lot of people are going to be asking that question you know so it’s you know it’s I mean but I mean you know people in campaigns like countries get determined by you know how they deal with a crisis and you know they have to they have to they have to deal with this you know over the next you know week over the next two months in order to you know I mean be you know more reassuring and you know you know I mean that’s like it’s I mean campaigns and politics are not easy but you know then there are a lot of big you know or structural issues you know that you know that are going on here that you know where the Democrats should have an advantage where the Biden campaign should have an advantage you know but you know I mean it’ll it’ll take time we’ll see John do you expect Joe Biden to be the uh the leader of the democratic ticket come November what you are witnessing now is a slow motion coup and it started during the debate last night when the watch party that various Democratic congressmen were attending they all turned to each other and said oh my God and one of them said if we’re on the same ballot as this guy we’re not going to keep the Senate we’re going to lose the house and we’re going to go suffer horribly up and down the ticket and another Democratic donor told me please name me the name of the major Democratic donor who will give Joe Biden a penny more now a penny more there is no such person so the Democrats are going to mount a slow motion coup behind the scenes and they you know the spin machine isn’t working and it’s going to be tough because Joe Biden is one of the most stubborn people in the in the political world but there is a way to do it um uh the only problem is that the likely success probably involves elevating Camala Harris the vice president to the Democratic ticket at the top and if that happens she’s less popular than he is that’s not necessarily A solution that trades trades one problem for another now there are other candidates who might do better Gretchen Whitmer of Michigan but the logistics of removing the first africanamerican woman to serve as vice president and replacing them with someone shall we say who’s doesn’t meet the identity politics of the democratic party that’s a daunting task but the Democratic party is almost in the same way that they United in 2020 to stop Bernie Sanders and Elevate Joe Biden when they should have known better because of his limitations in 2020 they are now uniting behind the scenes to try to figure out a way to push him off the stage I just don’t know if it will work there is an argument that the Republicans would find themselves in trouble if uh Joe Biden were to be replaced because then the attention would be focused on on Donald Trump a candidate who as you admitted did not do particularly well uh in the debate last night is there is there weight to that uh to that suggestion it’s an argument the only problem is remember it’s the Biden Harris Administration so all of the problems that people are blaming Joe Biden for inflation foreign policy disarray are the Biden Harris record so yes uh there would be a little more attention on Donald Trump but I don’t think it would dramatically change the race because I mean I know that there attempts to say that Camala Harris’s interviews last night were evidence of new political genius and skill on her part objectively speaking that’s simply not true just before I let you go I’ll ask you both this I mean and you both hinted at this that that many Americans are not happy with either of these people being on the ticket and that this is not the fight that that people Wanted coming out of this John what could possibly change here did this change anybody’s mind I think what we have is a complete failure of the two-p party system in America the Republican party has to Bear uh a terrible responsibility for having Donald Trump take over the Republican party and the Democratic party has to explain how in the world did you nominate this guy you knew his problems you knew that Barack Obama had complete contempt for him as vice president despite the fact he does fundraisers for him he once famously said you know there’s no ABS there’s no limit to how much Joe Biden can blank up a situation and Obama’s own defense secretary Robert Gates said Joe Biden has been on the wrong side of every foreign policy issue for the last 50 years so both parties have to explain to the American people how did you nominate these people and I think frankly keeping Robert F Kennedy off the ballot I’m not a partisan for Robert F Kennedy but but using thuggish tactics to make sure that he would not appear on the on the debate stage last night simply shows that the two-party system isn’t delivering choices the American people want and frankly has failed the country because to end up with a trump Biden race is a failure of democracy Craig well clearly three quarters of the American public are unhappy with their choices uh in this election you know clearly I think that you know when when when the tolling sorts itself out you know over this which is not going to happen in 24 hours people are going to be going to remain you know unhappy you know with their choices and that’s unfortunate but you know I think that I mean John alluded not just the United States but a lot of countries are you know going through some significant internal turmoil for a number of reasons on you know some of the same issues that are happening in the United States but you know that each country is somewhat different I mean in some ways everybody needs to ask what kind of country we want you know over the next four years and you know that’s a very difficult conversation to have I don’t think that we’ve had it as much as we should have and again you know we’re living in unprecedented times I mean we have people surrounding Donald Trump who condemned him and voted for impeachment three and a half years ago I I I’ve said before on CBC it’s like you know we’re going through a very unhappy time in the United States and that was true four years ago and it’s true today it’s a long road until November we will talk again um before we get there in the meantime thank you very much for this morning thank you gentlemen John fund is a columnist for the National Review senior fellow at the committee to unleash prosperity and Craig varoga is a democratic strategist based in Washington DC
U.S. President Joe Biden and former president Donald Trump faced off in their first debate of the 2024 presidential election on Thursday night. National Review columnist John Fund and Democratic strategist Craig Varoga discuss who came out on top and why with Matt Galloway.
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